emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby dirty sanchez » Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:36 am

Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:Cop: it's okay, we only kill black people

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/30/co ... eople.html

I predict the rational centrist response will be: "Oh, it's fine because he was just trying to calm the woman down" :roll:
Well, he's right because 99% of the crimes are committed by them.


OHOHO! Watch out, we got an edgelord over here.
If you're going to act like an imbecile, I just need to bring it down to your level. :8)


Aww DAMMIT sanchex! This will not get you invites to the finer-things club. :kaboom:
Sounds very elitist.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby Charon21 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:56 am

dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:Cop: it's okay, we only kill black people

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/30/co ... eople.html

I predict the rational centrist response will be: "Oh, it's fine because he was just trying to calm the woman down" :roll:
Well, he's right because 99% of the crimes are committed by them.


OHOHO! Watch out, we got an edgelord over here.
If you're going to act like an imbecile, I just need to bring it down to your level. :8)


Aww DAMMIT sanchex! This will not get you invites to the finer-things club. :kaboom:
Sounds very elitist.


It's great, all the cool kids are here -- like George Soros and Nancy Pelosi. :mrgreen:
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby dirty sanchez » Fri Sep 01, 2017 6:13 am

Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:
dirty sanchez wrote:
Charon21 wrote:Cop: it's okay, we only kill black people

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/30/co ... eople.html

I predict the rational centrist response will be: "Oh, it's fine because he was just trying to calm the woman down" :roll:
Well, he's right because 99% of the crimes are committed by them.


OHOHO! Watch out, we got an edgelord over here.
If you're going to act like an imbecile, I just need to bring it down to your level. :8)


Aww DAMMIT sanchex! This will not get you invites to the finer-things club. :kaboom:
Sounds very elitist.


It's great, all the cool kids are here -- like George Soros and Nancy Pelosi. :mrgreen:
Yup. Love them. Because they just keep pushing those in the center more to the right. :wink:
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 12:29 pm

We are about 1 more stupid comment away from locking this up.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby yoop » Fri Sep 01, 2017 1:42 pm

BF004 wrote:We are about 1 more stupid comment away from locking this up.


why is it that all comments have to be smart? we are talking about very stupid things here, police abusing there rights and others in the process.

just look at this lack of brains action by a cop that wants to abuse people and the laws he swore to uphold

https://www.yahoo.com/news/nurse-scream ... 36094.html
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 2:31 pm

BF004 wrote:There will always be people who give a 'black eye' associated with a group of people (Muslims, jews, right wingers, cops, blacks, men, women, priests, liberals, Yooper's from the UP, rural, farmers, urban, wealthy, unemployed, etc. etc. etc.).

You can either choose to let these reinforce your stereotypes to make them stronger, or understand that the person you are making note of and those like them likely make up less than <1% of that population your are fixated on.

Now I'm sure we can turn this into an exciting rendition of who can find the most news articles supporting their concluded opinions in a country of 400 million people, surely won't be hard to find several examples to support any opinion. Even wrong ones.

Instead what are some solutions, ideas for improvements? Just let African Americans fend for themselves because Asian Americans were able able to overcome their past oppressions? Make all cops take sensitivity training? Give them tanks or rocket launchers? Only let straight white males get only 3/5th's vote? 2/5th's if they are law enforcement? Double police training on law? Make a simpler law system? Make even more laws specific for every race/culture/protected group?

Or should we just keep searching google to find stories we want to see so we can show them to people on a forum we disagree with?

yoop wrote:why is it that all comments have to be smart?
All? I'd be happy to see one from you. :wink:
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby yoop » Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:20 pm

BF004 wrote:
BF004 wrote:There will always be people who give a 'black eye' associated with a group of people (Muslims, jews, right wingers, cops, blacks, men, women, priests, liberals, Yooper's from the UP, rural, farmers, urban, wealthy, unemployed, etc. etc. etc.).

You can either choose to let these reinforce your stereotypes to make them stronger, or understand that the person you are making note of and those like them likely make up less than <1% of that population your are fixated on.

Now I'm sure we can turn this into an exciting rendition of who can find the most news articles supporting their concluded opinions in a country of 400 million people, surely won't be hard to find several examples to support any opinion. Even wrong ones.

Instead what are some solutions, ideas for improvements? Just let African Americans fend for themselves because Asian Americans were able able to overcome their past oppressions? Make all cops take sensitivity training? Give them tanks or rocket launchers? Only let straight white males get only 3/5th's vote? 2/5th's if they are law enforcement? Double police training on law? Make a simpler law system? Make even more laws specific for every race/culture/protected group?

Or should we just keep searching google to find stories we want to see so we can show them to people on a forum we disagree with?

yoop wrote:why is it that all comments have to be smart?
All? I'd be happy to see one from you. :wink:


well, isn't that what people here do, bring articles that support opinions they already have? seems like that is whats went on here for 10 years, all of OB's term, right wingers here brought articles supporting there hatred for him, now the shoe is on the other foot, and Trump's personal views concerning racial issues are front page news, as is Kaepernicks stance, along with Aarons feelings on the topic.

I get that you don't like to see division in the forum, or personal attacks from members, but it's not as though thats new in this forum, been going on a long time.

58% of people polled said race relations since Trumps been in office have gotten much worse, thats relavent news don't you think?
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:44 pm

A) Don't fight stupidity with stupidity, shouldn't need to be said

B) I don't mind seeing division, I would just encourage productive dialogue, not just they were mean before so now I'll be mean because I think I'm right. And yes, personal attacks never have been and never will be tolerated. There has surely been different levels of moderation at different times, I'm still relatively new to the team here.

C) Yes, it is relevant news and its what every topic is about here and I don't think we are doing anything to limit it's discussion. But we haven't been discussing it. Mostly just sarcastic comments rebuttaled with childish disrespectful remarks from both sides. Or should I say 'From many sides'? :8)
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby Charon21 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:38 pm

I thought it was fairly obvious that my stupid posts were meant to make light of a depressing issue rather than attack anyone, but I stand corrected.

For the third time now, this is not about supporting some "concluded opinion." I was raised on the good police narrative, never had bad experiences firsthand, and long subscribed to that view...

... then I opened my eyes. So, really, it's quite the opposite. I had to have my initial concluded opinion erode first, and I held firm to it for a while as well. I threw that canard out a few times myself: they are trying to protect us, most are good, and it's no more fair to stereotype them negatively than anyone else .... except, being a cop is not like being born into a ethnic or national origin, and it's not like religion where you are indoctrinated it at birth. You sign on voluntarily, and -- good or not -- you do things the way it's been prescribed.

When the 13th Amendment was passed, slavery was abolished, but that abolition did not apply to those who were guilty of a crime. So, through mass-incarceration, slavery continued anyway as the South's economy demanded it. Over 100 years later, our criminal-justice system largely still runs the same way. Nixon recognized that, and put his political opponents away (blacks, hippies) through it via the War on Drugs. Then came the rise of the private prison industrial complex, where money drives the need to throw people behind bars, and it remains to this day.

The system is rotten, to the core. You can flood it with all the good people in the world and it will not get better, any more than a rotting tree will get better just because you stick healthy leaves onto it. It lives on arresting, convicting, and imprisoning people -- first slaves, then liberals, now inner-city dwellers -- like an animal needs to mate, kill, and feed. Cops are cogs in that machine, no matter how well-intentioned.

Yes, I've shared articles on this subject. I like evidence :dunno . Speaking in vague, subjective statements like "no, the vast majority are good people"(Why? Because I said so) does not impress me. It was stuff like that which changed my view, so I thought I'd use them to try to show things from my perspective.

We are a callous society. We see prisoners as a subhuman species and deserving all their punishment, as if thinking so makes us righteous (I know this because I've had that view previously). That needs to end. Our priority needs to change. We just want safety and retribution. We need to move toward safety and rehabilitation. So: stop criminalizing drug use, have police train (more) in deescalation tactics (one Oregon PD has been doing this with some pretty positive results thus far), stop housing prisoners in sub-human conditions, abolish the death-penalty (we are the only modern nation that still practices it, smh), abolish for-profit prisons, and focus on treatment and rehabilitation to make prisoners functional members of society again after they earn back their freedom.

There, those are my solutions.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby wallyuwl » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:45 pm

I'm with Charon on one point: that not all cops are good, and most think the rules and laws that apply to everyone else don't apply to them. I'm not with him in thining the system has been rigged against blacks since the Civil War. Inner cities are swarming with cops because that is where there is more crime. Inner cities happen to be mostly minorities. But if those minorities don't commit crimes, there would be no need for the high police presence. But cops do take it too far a lot of times with stopping people without cause to question them on the street, etc.

That said, I think the witch hunts against cops that shoot at suspected criminals who don't abide by their orders, carry weapons or flaunt them or even shoot at cops, etc. is on the criminals and not the cops that shoot them in self defense. I can't think of one cop who has been convicted in a court of law, where evidence and not public hysteria is what is followed, in any of these cop shooting cases that BLM has gone nuts over.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:02 pm

Well for #$%!'s sake https://www.lp.org/issues/crime-and-justice/. Only difference between what you said and what is listed there is private prisons a little. Some of the more hardcore libertarians, the alt north? Will want private prisons as they'll fight for anything that decreases the governments size, however to the best of my knowing every libertarian that has run as President were big believers in public prisons as it is the government duty to protect your rights and the only reason to be incarcerated is if you voluntarily relinquish you rights through malicious or violent crimes and is then thus the responsibility of the federal government.

Yet Johnson was a wasted vote because he didn't know what Allepo was, neither did I. I did know Trump and Hillary were both completely full of $#!! and themselves and were two of the most dishonest politicians to ever be nominated for President.

Although try talking about reducing government's footprint on the economy, reducing government reliance, or stopping the federal government from running the most complex inefficient healthcare in the modernized world and you'll just get a two word response. You're racist.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby APB » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:21 pm

There are nearly 1 million sworn, full-time police officers in the US. That number swells well beyond 1 million when you count all the part-timers.

Unless I've missed the listing of some 500,000+ additional examples of bad cops out there doing bad things, the statement "mostly maniacs and out of control" is just as I described it: idiotic leftist hyperbole with no substantive data to back it up. You know, the same "because I said so" rhetoric you are now decrying. Physician, heal thyself!
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:23 pm

wallyuwl wrote:I can't think of one cop who has been convicted in a court of law, where evidence and not public hysteria is what is followed, in any of these cop shooting cases that BLM has gone nuts over.


This is true to an extent. Eric Holder and Jesse Jackson were so involved with Ferguson, yet beyond reasonable doubt, Michael Brown was shot while fighting with a Police officer and trying to grab his gun after robbing a convience store. This was proved to a degree that Eric Holder defended the justice departments decision yet called for change after. Those things are all what happened.

Yet BLM and the media still to this day push the story that he was shot in the back unprovoked.

So how can you push for or fight against a social agenda when one sides knows what happened and want to work from there and the other end is starting from a totally false baseline.

I frankly don't understand if all this mistreatment is so prevalent, why is there a need to lie about a story? This is one story got so much publicity, that half the country saw what really happened and don't understand the protests justification for it. In no way reflects reality of the world, but to have this and have MSNBC get caught editing tapes to make George Zimmerman seem like a racist, both these stories do more harm than good for pushing social justice.

Similar to global warming debate. If it is so bad, why do people constantly get caught faking numbers? Just give opposing viewpoints more doubt.

Honest conversations need to be had to make progress. Perpetuating a lie to advance your agenda will have an opposing effect. Everyone should always strive to simply be as accurate as possible.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:30 pm

Now I will say it is bad, I think the police goals in general, particularly with drugs is way off base. I think the racial component is real but exaggerated. More to do with socio-economic probabilities than anything else. I also think climate change is very real, but no where close to understood yet. But lying about either topic just hurts any advancement.

I agree pretty much 100% with the libertarian view, I( mean Charon's view :wink: ), on what the police force's role should be on our country.
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Re: emptying the closet, and exposing dirty laundry

Postby BF004 » Sat Sep 02, 2017 3:32 am

Charon21 wrote: We see prisoners as a subhuman species and deserving all their punishment, as if thinking so makes us righteous (I know this because I've had that view previously). That needs to end. Our priority needs to change. We just want safety and retribution. We need to move toward safety and rehabilitation. So: stop criminalizing drug use, have police train (more) in deescalation tactics (one Oregon PD has been doing this with some pretty positive results thus far), stop housing prisoners in sub-human conditions, abolish the death-penalty (we are the only modern nation that still practices it, smh), abolish for-profit prisons, and focus on treatment and rehabilitation to make prisoners functional members of society again after they earn back their freedom.

There, those are my solutions.


Thank you for a well thought out and articulated response. My favorite part about it is you said it all without saying Trump or racist. Actually allows me to read through it without just rolling my eyes every other sentence.
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